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Transcript

Beyond Either/Or: Queering Contemplation with Cassidy Hall

Dear Listeners,

In times of intense darkness, being centered becomes more important than ever – especially if we want to sustain our faith, our activism, our relationships, even our own sense of self.

This week’s podcast episode builds on the conversation Emma and I had with Nancy Sylvester about the contemplative renewal that followed the Second Vatican Council. But this time, I’m joined by Cassidy Hall to explore what contemplation means in a world of political chaos, digital noise, and spiritual burnout—especially for queer people.

Cassidy’s book, Queering Contemplation, is excellent. She makes a compelling case that while the contemplative tradition has often been shaped by patriarchal and heteronormative voices, it is not closed to us. In fact, queer experience itself can open new pathways into embodiment, integration, and non-dual awareness.

In our conversation, we talk about moving beyond rigid either/or thinking, how contemplation reshapes our relationship to our bodies, and why this practice feels especially urgent for the next generation growing up in a time of massive dysregulation and trauma. Queer people have something vital to contribute here. We know what it means to live between categories, to wrestle with identity in public, and to search for wholeness in systems that fragment us. Contemplation can be a way we stay grounded enough to engage the world without being consumed by it.

✨✨ Book Giveaway: I’ll be giving away a few copies of Queering Contemplation to both free and paid subscribers. To enter, make sure you’re subscribed and fill out this Google Form with your name and email. If you’re selected as a winner, I’ll reach out by email to request your mailing address.

Book Giveaway


🎧 Listen to the podcast here on Substack (where you can toggle between video with subtitles and just the audio file, and read a transcript by clicking the button on the top of the episode page on the web), Spotify (which has video and in-app transcripts), Apple Podcasts (which has in-app transcripts), and YouTube.


If this episode resonates, I’d love to hear your thoughts—reply to this email or leave a comment. And a big thanks, as always, to the paid subscribers who support the show and my writing.

Grateful you’re here,
Max

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